Talk:Unique weapons
List Its probably best if we list the robots were are going to put on the page here so they can be discussed. Here's the ones I was thinking of: *Tentomushi - The smothering bit *Stinger/Flip Flop Fly *Binky *Eye of Newt *Forklift's Revenge/Firestorm 1 Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 20:14, November 19, 2009 (UTC) I've been thinking of a few... *Twn Trwn *Lizzard *Sting and Big Brother *Toe Cutter RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 20:31, November 19, 2009 (UTC) :What exactly were Lizzard and Twn Trwn's weapons? Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 20:34, November 19, 2009 (UTC) ::Lizzard had a flailing tail with spikes, and Twn Trwn had a head that fired out with a pneumatic piston. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 20:43, November 19, 2009 (UTC) Mousetrap?--'SquirrelMonkey (talk)' 20:48, November 19, 2009 (UTC) :Nope, it will be on Overhead Weapons. Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 20:50, November 19, 2009 (UTC) Oh, and Roter Osche. It's vaguely a spike, but not really. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 20:53, November 19, 2009 (UTC) :Isn't stinger a FBS?--'SquirrelMonkey (talk)' 20:52, November 19, 2009 (UTC) ::Not really. Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 20:55, November 19, 2009 (UTC) ::::::Perhaps we should have unique overhead weapons as part of this page, with Stinger and other axlebots, as well as Mousetrap. I can't think of any other unique overhead weapons, so its probably best to go on here under a section. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 04:08, November 20, 2009 (UTC) ::::::::Good idea. 'Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 07:33, November 20, 2009 (UTC) How about Hoot? Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 11:44, November 20, 2009 (UTC) :Hoot would be an "Other Type" Heavy Rotating Weapon. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 15:33, November 20, 2009 (UTC) :UFO in Series 6? Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 21:30, November 20, 2009 (UTC) ::Lifting Device. You can say something about the claw if you wish, but it's not a gripper because the claw was static. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 03:46, November 21, 2009 (UTC) :::how about Axios or Hammer & Tong? Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 19:17, November 21, 2009 (UTC) Thwackbots proposal I'd like to propose that we make a page for thwackbots, that is, a robot that attacks by spinning itself in circles, because it seems like we have a lot of those. There would be a subcategory for axlebots like Stinger, Flip Flop Fly, Atilla, etc. They fit the category because they are capable of thwacking, but choose not to. In addition the category "Full Body Spinners" should be changed to "Shell Spinners" to help avoid confusion. Any thoughts? RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 04:15, November 21, 2009 (UTC) :I like this idea. To check I've understood it right, would we include Bernard in the main part and Weeliwako in the axlebots? Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 10:02, November 21, 2009 (UTC) ::Yes to Wheeliwakko, no to Bernard. We must avoid the pitfall of including every robot that employed the tactic of sit-and spin. Any robot can do that, but this category is only for those who were designed specifically to. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 15:22, November 21, 2009 (UTC) :::So which robots would be in the main category? Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 15:34, November 21, 2009 (UTC) ::::Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Dantomkia described as a FBS by it's team?--'SquirrelMonkey (talk)' 16:53, November 21, 2009 (UTC)--'SquirrelMonkey (talk)' 16:53, November 21, 2009 (UTC) :::::Yes, but again this category is only for robots who are designed to sit and spin as a primary weapon, not as an emergency tactic. To answer Helloher's question, the main catergory is for sit-and-spins that are incapable of doing the overhead bit. Off the top of my head, that would include Wizard, T-Wrecks, Spin Doctor, Lizzard, Brawler, Spin Doctor, Riptillion, and IDO (because of that pickaxe tail). RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 17:37, November 21, 2009 (UTC) :::::::So would we remove Spin Doctor, T-Wracks and Wizard from the rotating blades page? Helloher (Death is not my phone number) 18:47, November 21, 2009 (UTC) ::::::::That's right. I didn't really feel like they fit there. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 19:21, November 21, 2009 (UTC) Robots in the page This conversation was a bit lost after the thwackbot page was created. I'm going to restart the conversation, by listing everyone we had plus a few I've thought of. Please note my opinion may have changed from previous discussion above. *Tentomushi *Binky *Eye of Newt *Twn Trwn *Sting and Big Brother *Toe Cutter *Mousetrap *Saw Point (Series 4)'s wheels *Roter Osche *Hammer & Tong *Darke Destroyer 2's wagglers *Piranha *Broadsword *Dome *Evolution *Daisy *Reactor *Wowot Additionally, we have robots like Fluffy, Hoot and IG-88 who all categorise together but don't have a name. They could be categorised together, but heavy rotating weapons and hammers are both taken. Any thoughts or additions? :Saw-Point's spike was pretty unique too; it spread apart, maybe that's worth a double listing? I put Twn Trwn where it is because we had no other categories for retracting weapons, I guess it could qualify as unique. Eye of Newt and Biinky, aren't those just static wedges? And don't we have Hammer & Tong listed as both a spiked axe and flipping arm? RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 04:29, March 10, 2011 (UTC) ::I would support Saw Point and Hammer and Tong as double listings. Eye of Newt I'm sure is a basic wedge but Binky's could move and was called something along the lines of a battle sled, so I say keep it. I've added Dark Destroyer 2 for the wagglers, Dome for the trebuchet, and Daisy, Broadsword and Pirahna for the blades. I am thinking about Destruct-A-Bubble (Series 5 only) and Tornado's anti-crusher frame, and Evolution for that thing it had. Also, I need more opinion on the heavy rotaters. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 07:29, March 10, 2011 (UTC) :::It sounds like you need three categories - Unique variations on existing themes (Which would cover Mousetrap & Fluffy), Unique weapons & Double acting weaponry (covering Hammer & Tong's lifter/axe & Reactor's flamp). Mousetrap had a blade & a guillotine, so should be listed twice. If you do go for this though,I nominate The Morgue on the grounds that it has a small but perfectly formed Trident on its lifter.It did pierce Ming 2. 'Almighty_crj(My Talk) 11:17, March 10, 2011 (UTC) ::::Surely Sting and Big Brother would go under flails? On that note, does Mighty Mouse count as a flail? Also, I think that Fluffy and IG-88 should go under a page "Unique rotating weapons". Middle Eye 20:48, March 10, 2011 (UTC) ::::Been doing some thinking on Heavy Rotating Weapons, I'm thinking the most practical thing to do would be rename the pages to "Heavy Horizontal Rotating Weapons" (Flywheels and Other) "Heavy Vertical Rotating Weapons" (Flywheels, Other), and "Heavy Centralized Spinning Weapons" (Full-Body and non full-body), and keep Drums as is. This will make it so that all the weapons with the same function and same strengths and weaknesses are on the same page. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 20:57, March 10, 2011 (UTC) :::::It would, but at the same time, it pushes towards what I've been trying to avoid in my big split. Pearce and the roboteers don't refer to "Heavy Horizontal Rotating Weapons", they refer to flywheels, drums, etc. I would really prefer to keep it as it is and have a new category for Fluffy, Hoot and the rest. :::::Regarding what else has been said, I'm not sure Sting and Big Brother are flails, because they aren't rotating weapons. Mighty Mouse functions very similarly to Lizzard, but its not a sit-and-spin robot, so I'm guessing it either goes here or gets disregarded. I have added Morgue and Reactor, but I'm still awaiting opinion on robots like Destruct-A-Bubble. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 22:01, March 10, 2011 (UTC) ::::Sure sure. In that case I think the best we can really do is a miscellaneous spinning weapons section. Calling Fluffy's weapon "Unique" gives it too much credit IMO, a great weapon yes, but only so because it stuck to conventions. I'd like to avoid the trappings of calling every dual-acting weapon "unique," if it's a combination of two weapons like Hammer and Tong, then just list it under both. If it's a flipper with a secondary function (like Reactor) then it goes on the Flipper page with a note that it could also clamp, because a flipper that can clamp is not unique. Morgue is just your run-of-the-mill lifter, you'll observe that on the "Lifting Weapons" page, I listed a strength of lifting weapons to be that they could double as spears. Destruct-A-Bubble, well, that's just an Arnold A Termineeger-style axe, albeit woefully underpowered. 'RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 00:17, March 11, 2011 (UTC) ::::::Sounds good. I'll make those changes on the list above. Just one last thing, where do we stand on Twn Trwn? Toon Ganondorf (t ''' 03:59, March 11, 2011 (UTC) :::::::Twn Trwn originally had a snowplough, but had to have it removed. I dunno where "snowplough" goes, but it should probably be mentioned there, maybe...CrashBash 09:19, March 11, 2011 (UTC) ::::RA2, I don’t quite follow the logic your post. '''All of these weapons stick to conventions. I mean, the Mousetrap bar itself just really impacts another machine – it’s a hammer by nature if not design. It’s the combination of it with the wedge that makes it unique. This makes it a double weapon &, by RA2 logic, list able on two separate existing pages. All that aren’t list able on separate pages aren’t weapons, by the virtue of creating no damage such as a ladybird cover, conveyor belt or a battle sled. Once you eliminate all of those, you have no unique weapons – which means you either junk all plans for the page or use it for trivia on uniquities, on which The Morgue would qualify – the small trident is to a lifter what Mousetrap’s bar/guillotine is to a hammer/axe.* Look, I’m commenting as a reader of the wiki & the talk section – if you all really want to do is stick your fingers in your ears to one of the very few bits of feedback you’re going to get and do whatever the hell you want, that is fine by me. Oh & btw you forgot Wowot!Almighty_crj(My Talk) 11:17, March 10, 2011 (UTC ::::::See the little asterisk I put into your message? That's the point where I stopped listening. I don't know why you felt the need to go off on me like that, but it makes people (myself included) take you less seriously. When you have something to say, just give your opinion, there's no need to cry out like you're being attacked just because someone disagrees with you. RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 15:22, March 11, 2011 (UTC) :::::::Whilst I criticise his methods of communication, I find myself agreeing with Almighty crj's logic. His points about Mousetrap, Hammer and Tong and Wowot are very valid and I feel that his opinion is the most viable here. Mousetrap is in theory a hammer weapon, but its design is so unique that it warrants a different approach. In fact, it often acts like a pair of jaws, giving it the dual position. I think Hammer & Tong's and Reactor's weapons belong on this page because, despite functioning the same as two weapons, they are unique in design. In fact, I used a majority of User:CrashBash's weapons list to mould this page. That is just my stance on the matter. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 23:02, March 11, 2011 (UTC) Would Havoc's mace fit into this category? I ask because it doesn't rotate like flails do. Middle Eye 18:11, April 19, 2011 (UTC) Prototype I've used Mousetrap as a prototype as what I think the page should look like. Does anyone have any thoughts? 'Toon Ganondorf (t ' 09:23, March 11, 2011 (UTC) :The table is a bit too wide for the page, but otherwise it looks pretty good. CrashBash 09:39, March 11, 2011 (UTC) ::I'm on Monobook so I can't tell. I couldn't find a way to compress it, unless the picture could be reduced? We'll wait for other opinions. 'Toon Ganondorf (t ' 09:40, March 11, 2011 (UTC) :::I was able to make it fit by adjusting the picture settings from 200 to 150. CrashBash 10:01, March 11, 2011 (UTC) ::::Good, looks fine on my end. 'Toon Ganondorf (t ' 23:02, March 11, 2011 (UTC) Spinning Weapons Are we going ahead with adding all unique spinning weapons to this page? If so, we should list them here, as we still have a lot of uncategorized spinning weapon robots. Off the top of my head: *IG-88 *Fluffy *The Alien *Revolution *Twister (Dutch) *Axe-C-Dent *Zorro *Gi-Ant-O(I know there are more robots with Hazard-esque weaponry, perhaps discuss another spinner category?) Feel free to add above if you have any more. 'RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 04:07, March 15, 2011 (UTC) :I strongly support IG-88's place on this page; the fact that it is a bi-rotational weapon capable of spinning in both directions makes it very notable, much more so than Alien or Revolution. I don't, however, know about the others. Zorro, apart from Son of Whyachi, is the only robot with such a design, to my knowledge, and Revolution's huge weapon is definately able to classify as uniqe. Twister's triange is another that gets me thinking. However, I agree with your earlier feeling that calling Fluffy's and The Alien's weapons unique gives them too much credit and if they can be fitted elsewhere, they should be. Axe-C-Dent and The Alien belong together, wherever that may be. However, if Zorro and the others are fitted in, I have no idea whether we can justify a new category for those remaining. I also want to bring up Angle Grinder: I added it to the template because i thought of robots like Small Torque, but come to think of it, I dont think there are any others. Opinion? Toon Ganondorf (t ' 08:20, March 15, 2011 (UTC) ::Would you be open to another category in the Heavy Rotating Weapons called "Rotating Arms"? It would include all robots all the robots with big spinning bars or blades (There are a handful of entries in "Lawnmower Blades" that are too powerful to be there.) It would take care of Fluffy, Gi-Ant-O, Axe-C-Dent, and The Alien among others. My problem with IG-88 is that I can't understand what advantage its spinner brings to the table. It's completely impratical to have a spinner like that spin both ways; if it hits something while spinning downward, the recoil will cause it to fall forward, flipped backside-up and probably out of the competition. There were plenty of robots with vertical spinning motors that ''could run both ways, I'm just struggling to understand what IG-88 gets out of doing so. :: Small Torque's weapon looked more like a spinning disc to me, I could see two small spikes juttign out during the pit interview, I wouldn't call it an angle grinder. In terms of true angle gringers, Demolition Demon had one, but it looked more or less the same as a circular saw, and I can't think of any others, so it's no skin off my back if we call it such. '''RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 16:03, March 15, 2011 (UTC) :::You make very good points, and although I am reluctant to see IG-88 removed, if you make the page up, I will support its change. I'll remove Angle Grinders now. However, please post those on the lawnmower blades page who you think should swap, because besides $6 Million Mouse, I can't see any. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 22:02, March 15, 2011 (UTC) :::Additionally, neither Zorro nor Twister (Dutch) belong in a rotating arms category. They are not fully body spinners nor flywheels. Do they go here? 'Toon Ganondorf (t ' 22:03, March 15, 2011 (UTC) :::Is it ok if I do the page over the weekend? I know it's better sooner than later, but I'm just inundated (never thought I'd actually use that word) with schoolwork. In the meantime I'll support Zorro and Twister moving here, and on the Lawnmower blades page I'll make that list of move candidates. 'RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 22:16, March 15, 2011 (UTC) ::::I completely understand, its my third week of university and I'm already feeling like I'm falling behind. I guess I spend too much time here. I've removed IG-88 and added Daisy, and I too support Twister and Zorro's move. Toon Ganondorf (t ''' 22:18, March 15, 2011 (UTC) Cronos It was a flipper and a crusher. Should it go here? :If you think it belongs here, I have one word: Robochicken. It was pretty similar weapon-wise to Cronos, only with an axe instead of a crusher. Personally, I think Cronos deserves a mention here, because the crusher and the flipper were all mounted together on the same arm. We'll have a discussion on the Community Portal, and discuss until we reach a consensus.--'' STORM II '' 22:13, October 22, 2011 (UTC) ::On this point actually, consider Sir Chromalot and 8645T. Both have crusher/axe weapons connected to a flipper, so can any of them be considered unique? Charlie M 08:02, March 9, 2012 (UTC) :::Well, Cronos' weapons are backwards to 8645T and Sir Chromalot and it's a different combo from Robochicken. Robochicken only had it's axe/flipper combo weapon in Series 7, whilst 8645T had it's for two wars, Sir Chromalot's weapon as also only used for one Series (two if you include Extreme Series 1) and it wasn't that effective. '''Madlooney ::::Madlooney, at least you have a better memory than I. I think Cronos should stay put, its combo was introduced first chronologically (does Series 4 Robochicken have this? Don't think so methinks.) Alas, everyone else you've mentioned has a flipper and an axe. Cronos had a crusher and a lifter, not a flipper as it's a crusher so it moves very slowly. If that wasn't enough, here's the final nail in the coffin. To me, that looks like a no brainer. STORM II 16:29, March 9, 2012 (UTC) Lightning and Buzz They are currently on the Front-hinged true flippers page. Given that their weapons are not hinged at the front, and that there are no other machines I can think of that had this type of flipper design, should they go on this page instead? ManUCrazy (talk) 05:43, February 9, 2013 (UTC) :They have the same sort of design as a front-hinged flipper, although they are not technically hinged at the front. I don't mind too much either way, but if they are staying on that page then there should be some sort of note about them. Christophee (talk) 15:38, February 9, 2013 (UTC) ::This definition from the Front-hinged true flippers page suggests they do belong on that list: A robot's flipper is front-hinged if the robot flipper connects at the base of the robot, opening outwards. This is true of both Buzz and Lightning. Based on that, they should stay where they are, but maybe we should add to that definition that the flipper could technically be hinged on the side. Christophee (talk) 15:46, February 9, 2013 (UTC) :::Looking more closely at the definition, I'm not sure that robots like Lightning and Buzz have flippers that technically are hinged at the base of the robot. If they're hinged at the side of a wedge-shaped robot, then that's going to be higher than the base. Now I'm much less sure of where they belong. Christophee (talk) 12:50, February 10, 2013 (UTC) ::::The definition can probably change. Its not really important where the flipper is on the robot, its how the flipper opens. The Steel Avenger has a rear hinged flippers on its back, as does GBH 2, but neither goes on unique weapons cos its clearly a rear hinged flipper. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 09:59, February 11, 2013 (UTC) :::::Okey doke, I'll make an amendment to the definition and add a point saying that the flipper can be placed anywhere on the robot as long as it opens outwards. Christophee (talk) 11:08, February 11, 2013 (UTC) Flamethrower It's occured to me that, whilst all the other weapons of the house robots are listed on the respective weapons pages, there's nowhere mentioning the flamethrower Sgt Bash was famous for, or the one Growler temporarily had. I figure if it could be added anywhere, it would be here, since they were indeed unique (due to being otherwise illegal). Thoughts? CrashBash (talk) 10:45, August 29, 2014 (UTC) :I think there should be a mention now you mention it. Sam (BAZINGA) 11:29, August 29, 2014 (UTC) ::You would need Static Flamethrower for Growler and Rotating Flamethrower for Bash, or they kinda can't be classed as unique if we just say Flamethrower alone. Jimlaad43(talk) 12:24, August 29, 2014 (UTC) :::Not neccessarily, we've got a few robots listed with the same weapon set-up. "Unique" means that the weapons can't be categorised under any one category, not necessarily that it was only used on one robot. CrashBash (talk) 12:32, August 29, 2014 (UTC) :::: I think it could be a decent page. It would be far from the smallest or most superflouous article on the Wiki, I know that for a fact. If you want to have a go, you have my blessing. If it's bad enough to make me want to claw out my eyes and chuck my computer out the window, we'll just delete it and say "nothing ventured, nothing gained." I agree with Crash that the distinction beween "rotating" and "static" is unnecessary - fire's fire, and there weren't enough flamethrowers to really need special terminology. 'RA2; aka Resetti's Replicas. (My Talk) 20:00, August 29, 2014 (UTC) :::::The article can also go into detail about the flamethrowers around the side of the arena, and the ones in the video games, if we need more content. I'm all in favour of a full article. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'Toast']][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'Ultimatum']] 23:23, August 29, 2014 (UTC) What about Saw Point and Demolition Man's wheels? Should we include Saw Point (Series 4) and Demolition Man (Series 6)'s wheels in this list? Since they were used as a weapon in themselves. CaliforniaKingsnake (talk) 10:01, January 18, 2017 (UTC) 8645T and Sir Chromalot Both of these have the same weapon, a combination axe/flipper. The point of Unique is there is no other robot with that weapon. I think/propose we remove them from the list, as they contradict each other by being in there. Jimlaad43(talk) 11:08, March 22, 2017 (UTC) :The weapons don't have to be unique, they go here if they don't fit. We wouldn't remove flamethrowers because Growlers and Bash both have them. But I'd be fine with removing Sir Chromalot because I think the axe is more akin to TR2's (as in, not really an axe). 8645T should remain as it is more deliberately a unique weapon. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 11:24, March 22, 2017 (UTC) ::I don't think we can write off Sir Chromalot and TR2 just because the axes are naff - they are still axes, and that aided their applications. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'TOAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 15:09, March 22, 2017 (UTC) Any way we can condense the table? As I look at the table, the information is all wrong in terms of column size. Robot, Weapon, Picture and Series Appearances take up more width than the last three columns, which contain the main information, meaning each robot has three columns that are about 3 words wide and 10-20 lines tall. It doesn't look right at all. What can we do? Do we try to combine some of the early columns? Or maybe compile the last three columns into one? Jimlaad43(talk) 20:50, November 8, 2017 (UTC) :The flipper and axe were attached to the same ram, so that when the weapon fired, the axe would lower as the flipper raised. :Advantages: Protected the front and back of the robot at the same time. The weapons offered good leverage to one another, and the flipper could be reasonably effective. :Disadvantages: It did not allow 8645T to self-right from any position other than on its back.